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Turbulence (EPL Talk Review Podcast)

Speaker 3: Yeah, and actually after de Gea’s save in the 78th minute, he shouldn’t have to make that save. He made it because Dzeko was selfish and didn’t lay the ball off to Nasri, who probably would’ve scored. That’s why he was able to make that save. Yes, Smalling got exploited. I think Rafael was a huge miss today for United. He’s been a huge miss this whole time he’s been injured but really today. City went after right back using Nasri on the left and then he would push inside. He would Kolarov who is much more of an attacking threat than he is a – he is more of a defensive liability than he is a good defender.

From the left-back position, push up, have a lot of time and space to cross the ball because they didn’t have Rafael with those forward runs, and Kolarov, who is a suspect defender as I said, this is why Clichy tends to get the nod over him – Clichy was injured today – was not testing, was not forced to stay back in that left-back position because he doesn’t have the closing speed to chase down someone like a Rafael or Antonio Valencia if the right side of United’s attack had been working. That opened up space, time for the left side of City’s attack.  The strikers were clinical, Negredo in particular. Negredo didn’t score today but I thought he was actually, maybe, besides Nasri, the best player on the pitch for City. He was brilliant, his linkup play, his holdup play, timing of his runs. He was fantastic. Justifying Pellegrini’s choice to go with him over Dzeko who came on for a cameo and played selfishly in the 12 minutes he was on.

Speaker 4: Basically proved why he didn’t get to start today.

Speaker 3: Correct. That’s what you said on Twitter, Morgan, and you were correct.

Speaker 1: Great, let’s all just repeat our tweets eh, Morgan? I’m kidding. Kartik, [inaudible 00:17:26] sans Nasri.

Speaker 4: Fantastic today. I’ve been looking for Nasri this season because he closed last season very well with the two games after. He had an issue with Mancini, that’s well known. The two games after Mancini was sacked and then the summer tour of the States, which I saw in person, Nasri looked like a new player, a bright player. He looked like he was up for it. He was just beaten down by the former manager. And this season, in pre-season I thought he was maybe the best City player. Lo and behold, Silva comes back up from Confederations Cup and has moved right back into the squad ahead of Nasri. I haven’t seen out of Silva the kind of quality and creativity that we’ve seen from Nasri recently for about a year and a half, consistent creativity. There are moments for Silva, but Nasri, I think, now, with Silva’s injury realizes this is his chance to take it and prove to Pellegrini – Pellegrini probably predisposed towards Silva because he managed in Spain – to show him what he can do.  He was great at midweek in Champions League and today, just brilliant. Best player on the pitch for me, by a pretty wide margin. Was at the center of everything City did with the exception of the goal on the [inaudible 0:18:47] where Negrado and Yaya linked up well.

Speaker 1: [Inaudible 00:18:53] good isolating these things, Kartik. I think that you make a good point, you have to isolate the Derby in some ways.  When we keep isolating all these games and you tend to take it out on the wider picture and so what is the wider picture for both these clubs? United wowed earlier in the week in the Champions League and City somewhat underwhelmed. That’s probably being more than fair to them.

Speaker 4: Underwhelmed at Champions League?

Speaker 1: Yes.

Speaker 4: I don’t think so.

Speaker 1: Well, I feel like they underwhelmed. I didn’t think their performance was as good as it could’ve been.

Speaker 4: Well, it was away from home in Eastern Europe. I thought it was pretty good.

Speaker 1: That’s fair but I still think that with [inaudible 00:19:33] they have, et cetera then they’re kind of doing better.

Speaker 4: Well, go ahead. Go ahead.

Speaker 1: Still, outside these isolated situations, when we bring them together, what does it actually mean for both these Manchester sides because they’ve got a lot more competition this season from the other people around them. I guess the bigger picture for both managers is that they actually have to get some consistency here.

Speaker 4: Right. For Manchester City, it shows how they can play if they set up to attack and they set up to play, not on the break necessarily but with free flowing, creative midfielders and with the wide players pushed up, Kolarov and Navas in this case in particular. Then when Navas came off Wilmer was pushed pretty far into the attack as well. That shows how City can play and if you take the impetus, you can go and put games away in the first 50 minutes. Now, Manchester City has been poor in both their away matches in the Premier League, which is why I’m saying I don’t want to jump to conclusions about the Club. Two teams that are possibly going to be the relegation fight City has faced and [inaudible 0:20:42] won that game as I think we’ve discussed this last week.

Wider conclusions for City, we can wait on. Now, as far as Manchester United is concerned, it’s early. It’s been a bad start as far as their fixtures are concerned, but you have to be concerned about David Moyes’ tactical acumen in bigger matches. He got it right midweek against Leverkusen.  I think, Lawrence, you’re giving them far too much credit in that game. I’ve seen Leverkusen play a lot. That was one of the worst matches I’ve seen their backline play. I think United played well, don’t get me wrong. But I think they were helped in that situation. The three matches against top competition in the Premier League they have looked four going forward. They have looked destroying it at times. There has been confusion about where to be on the pitch, which you don’t see the organizational problems typically from the United side. Now, they’ve got Liverpool in midweek in the League Cup and normally that would not matter. It’s the Carling Cup and even if you get…

Speaker 1: Capital One Cup, Kartik.

Speaker 4: Oh sorry, Capital One Cup …

Speaker 1: What’s in your wallet?

Speaker 4: … even if you get eliminated by your biggest rival, it’s just the Carling – it’s just the Capital One Cup, excuse me. Thank you Lawrence.

Speaker 1: What’s in your glass?

Speaker 4: Right. Now with Moyes having already lost to Brendan Rodgers, having lost badly to Pellegrini, having dropped points to Mourinho at home, I have a feeling that just for his own peace of mind, and not that there’s anything remotely resembling a stacking that’s imminent but for his own peace of mind and to get some of these more deluded United fans off his back, he might have to win this game, whereas for Liverpool it would just be a bonus to win. There’s going to be a lot of pressure for a third-run League Cup match, something that you just don’t get at a [inaudible 00:22:30] match with United typically.

Speaker 1: I hope that’s somewhere in his team talk.  “Guys, it looks like we’re going to have to win this one, so go out there and try and score. Okay, you know what to do. Goodbye.” I guess, as much as Kartik details that, Chris, the great thing is that he makes a good point here. It isn’t the Carling Cup so if they don’t have a positive result there, then it’s not ultimately consequential hugely on their season. Equally, if they do win it, it’s a great boost for the squad.

Speaker 2: Yes. There is a lack of pressure there I guess, because of the competition and how it’s perceived value. It always means the most when you win it.  I tend to like because …

Speaker 1: They won it last season?

Speaker 2: …the supporters.  Honestly, I’d kill for a silver spoon at the moment, never mind a trophy. Yeah, it’s moving past that. I think it’s very easy to say and perhaps it’s the one place where all football fans can empathize to a degree is that we’ve probably all been spanked off a rival at some point. Thus, for that reason, you can say that as soon as the whistle goes it’s finished and is the oldest cliché there is It’s still only worth three points, although you could easily argue there has also been a mental advantage now gained from City’s perspective.

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  1. Jake

    September 25, 2013 at 8:30 am

    Long time listener, first time poster. Just wanted to point out Kris’ silence during the Ramsey/Piers Morgan discussion. I actually am a big fan of his analysis, but towards the end of last season, I remember a number of his articles on Soccernet advocating for Ramsey’s dropping/sale.

  2. Kartik Krishnaiyer

    September 24, 2013 at 11:47 am

    Good point Adam Heap.

  3. Adam Heap

    September 24, 2013 at 7:01 am

    I love listening to this podcast, but sometimes I wish you guys would all show a little support for the sides you follow! Kartik, you could hardly have sounded less enthusiastic about how well your club played in the derby (in spite of their history in derby matches, I know) – we all know which teams the presenters are backing, show some love for them every now and again – we know you need to be unbiased but supporters can’t help but love our clubs!

    • Jake

      September 25, 2013 at 8:27 am

      I dont think Morgan holds anything back…

      • Morgan Green

        September 25, 2013 at 4:55 pm


  4. Kartik Krishnaiyer

    September 23, 2013 at 5:27 pm

    I thought I mentioned Marshall but perhaps not. In fact I don’t know if I was called upon during this game, but it was late and we were trying to get the pod done. Lloris could have been sent off for that handball, as we saw a similar call last week. I don’t think Cardiff played with ten men behind the ball the entire game having now watched the full 90. Cardiff at times in the second half played a higher line and kept the ball.

    If you feel we don’t cover Spurs closely enough or are too biased towards Arsenal (an accusation you and some other Spurs fans have made towards me which conveniently ignores that Arsenal has finished ahead of Spurs for 17 consecutive seasons and with that they have earned some deference when compared to Spurs)we’d love to have you come on the podcast. Your points are well taken on this game. But understand with PSG-Monaco the biggest game of the weekend was on at 2:55 as was Milan-Napoli and having some other items to complete I didn’t get a chance to watch the game as closely as I would like before the pod. I have now watched it entirely. I also think this win indicates Spurs are a likely top 3 team as they have fared better than Everton and Man City (both outside the top 3 right now in my estimation) in South Wales. In fact this result gives Spurs more points in South Wales than City has in three trips to the area the last 3 seasons so that counts for something.

    Again, apologies. We try our best but sometimes it’s not good enough I suppose. If you want to help us with prep or even coming on in the future to discuss Spurs that’d be great!

    • Balboa77

      September 23, 2013 at 8:34 pm

      Dust on the podcast is a must listen for me. I am convinced “Dust” is a combination of people yelling at a computer screen while one person types. MAKE THIS HAPPEN!

      • Dust

        September 23, 2013 at 9:30 pm


    • Dust

      September 23, 2013 at 9:29 pm

      Thanks both of you for responding…

      I don’t think you are anti spurs, it’s a good example of a game that didn’t have the review it should’ve…

      I check back in every now and again, to see what changes (if any) there are to the coverage, esp with the changes on the site.

      Anyways…Thank you for asking, if time allows I’d be interested.

      • jtm371

        September 23, 2013 at 9:37 pm

        do it it would be EPIC!

        • dust

          September 24, 2013 at 12:57 pm

          Im happy to do it, Chris reached out for the king interview. If at some point they want it to happen i’m sure they will reach out, they have a million and one things going on.

      • COYS_USA1

        September 24, 2013 at 12:17 pm

        If Dust cant do it I would love to be on the pod

        • Balboa77

          September 24, 2013 at 8:58 pm

          No one invited you.

  5. Dust

    September 23, 2013 at 4:50 pm

    It sounded like no one watched the Spurs game, here are some talking points from the game oh…and it was Naughton was at left back, not Vertonghen.

    Cardiff’s keeper played out of his skin, he was peppered with shots and some how kept them out. It was complete domination by spurs…

    Cardiff no17 holding Lloris arm as the corner came in while another player used Dawson as human ladder for the disallowed goal they had.

    Lloris handled the ball on the edge (started on the line but handled it over the line too) of the 18m, after another dodgey back pass from Naughton.

    The football Spurs played was very very good, Cardiff had to play with 10 men behind the ball for 80 minutes.

    Lamela made the difference when he came on, as a very tired Cardiff couldn’t cope with his trickery and runs between them, yes Holtby played his part and did well.

    I can’t believe its co-incidence that when I choose to listen its only then that the summary of non major games are so poor.

    Cardiff’s keeper absolutely deserved a mention after putting on a performance similar to YL for WHIFC Paulinho & Dembele were sublime.

    Conceding 1 goal in 8 games (5 in BPL) for Spurs and scoring 16 best defensive record in BPL. And yes that’s quite an achievement with Dawson at the back.

    Contributors to the pod in the u.s have access to the games On Demand within an hour or so of them finishing, maybe I’m crazy, but perhaps someone from WST on the pod should watch, and then report.

    Just a thought.

    • Christopher Harris

      September 23, 2013 at 4:58 pm

      To be fair, the Tottenham match was being played at the same time as the biggest match of the weekend. Damn the Europa League!

      I’m sure a lot of people were watching the Arsenal-Stoke match instead of the Palace-Swansea one, too 😉

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