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YouTube TV on verge of losing 14 NBC channels

YouTube TV and NBC

Carriage disputes between cable/satellite providers and TV broadcasters seem to happen all the time. Generally, we associate those with Regional Sports Networks and the ability to watch local sports teams. However, the most recent dispute involves a streaming service and a major television broadcaster.

This most recent disagreement involves YouTube TV and NBCUniversal. The two American giants must come to an agreement prior to Thursday’s deadline. Furthermore, a failure to reach a deal means YouTube TV will remove all of NBCUniversal’s channels from their platform. Consequently, there would be a significant loss of content, including soccer coverage, for the service’s subscribers.

YouTube TV potentially losing chunk of channels

NBCUniversal currently owns 14 different channels that could no longer be available on YouTube TV. In fact, sports fans that follow the Premier League would lose almost all of their content. NBC, NBCSN, USA Network, Telemundo and Universo, all of which held Premier League games this season, are at risk. Moreover, channels like MSNBC, E!, Golf Channel, CNBC, SYFY and Bravo could be gone without a deal.

This week, NBCUniversal released a statement regarding their position in the standoff between the two media conglomerates.

“NBCUniversal is seeking fair rates from Google for YouTube TV’s continued carriage of the only portfolio offering entertainment, Hispanic, news, and sports networks. Unfortunately, Google is refusing to make a deal at these fair rates and is willing to withhold entertainment, news and sports programming from their paying customers. NBCUniversal feels a responsibility to inform our fans that they are at risk of losing their favorite shows if Google continues with their demands.”

Contrarily, YouTube TV also released a statement regarding their stance on the issue. The service is not like a normal cable provider, and it believes NBCUniversal is not providing a fair price.

“Our ask is that NBCU treats YouTube TV like any other TV provider. In other words, for the duration of our agreement, YouTube TV seeks the same rates that services of a similar size get from NBCU so we can continue offering YouTube TV to members at a competitive and fair price.”

According to an official communication from the streaming service, YouTube TV subscribers will not pay for channels they do not have access to. If the two companies fail to come to an agreement, the service will temporarily lower their rates. The service plans to lower their rates from $64.99 per month to $54.99. This price reduction would last until NBCUniversal’s channels reappear on the service’s lineup.

Unfortunate Timing

Timing is never good for these kinds of disputes; however, in this particular case, the timing couldn’t be any worse. NBC carries Sunday Night Football. With the current NFL season only starting a few weeks ago, subscribers could be set to miss most of NBC’s games this season.

NBC also owns the U.S. television rights to the English Premier League. If the service drops the NBC networks this week, soccer fans would miss out on quite possibly the marquee matchup of the entire season on Sunday: Liverpool versus Manchester City.

Not only would Premier League fans that currently pay for YouTube TV miss out on a massive match this weekend, but they could potentially be locked out of hundreds of Premier League games throughout the remainder of the 2021/22 campaign.

While Peacock does show select Premier League matches, it wouldn’t be an option in this case because matches that are televised on NBCSN are not available live on Peacock.

Another option is to consider switching to fuboTV, which includes all of the NBC channels as well as all of the beIN SPORTS channels, FOX, FS1, FS2, ESPN, ESPN2 and more soccer-related networks. fuboTV is currently offering a free 7-day trial.

YouTube TV launched in 2017 and has grown to become one of the most popular live television streaming services in America. The Google-owned company reportedly has over 3 million subscribers.

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  • Price: $4.99/mo
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  • Watch 175 exclusive EPL games per season
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  1. Ra

    October 1, 2021 at 11:34 am

    Interesting article:
    observer com/2021/09/state-of-the-streamer-apple-tv-is-charting-a-unique-path-through-the-streaming-wars/

  2. Michael F

    October 1, 2021 at 9:25 am

    @Ra. Yea, I hear ya… but I don’t look at that way. I am paying for a service to get many channels I watch throughout the course of any month, and losing NBCSN means I would have been inconvenienced far more than worrying about saving $10. I am sure the people that preferred the discount were not Soccer fans about to miss out on PL matches shown on NBCSN live.
    Yes, we know these cable-like packages like U Tube TV are pricey, but to get what I want (which is more than just PL matches)… I am willing to pay.

  3. Ra

    October 1, 2021 at 6:47 am

    @Michael F. Google outmaneuvered Comcast by offering users a discount and leaking their Peacock demands. Well done.

    I’ve seen many commentaries elsewhere that people actually preferred the discount. Considering that NBC is free, $10 for NBCSN seems very expensive when compared to Paramount+ or ESPN+. And it is so infested with commercials that they should be paying you to use it, like Bing did/does. The commercials alon are a deal breaker to me.

  4. Michael F

    September 30, 2021 at 11:32 pm

    A temporary agreement has been reached between You Tube TV and NBCU. So NBCU Channels stay on YouTube TV for now. I’m happy, as I don’t have to go free trial elsewhere to watch Liverpool/Man City on Sunday.

  5. Ra

    September 30, 2021 at 8:22 pm

    @Hans. Google on the other hand is very customer-oriented. They are just offering a free stadia premiere edition for those who buy a game now. You can get Fifa 22 for $59.99 and get the controller and chromecast ultra for free. I had preordered mine, so I am happy to get a freebie worth $80.

  6. Hans

    September 30, 2021 at 7:43 pm

    Oh SNAP, Comscum / NBCU just got hit big time and so will every other content provider unless they solve the falling TV subscribers and the streaming platforms.
    variety 9dot) com/vip/the-nbcuniversal-and-youtube-tv-standoff-isnt-just-another-carriage-dispute-1235076124/
    NBCU hasn’t helped by making its crown jewel, NFL “Sunday Night Football,” available on Peacock for $5 a month (or free to Xfinity broadband subscribers). By robbing network TV of exclusive content in order to try to drive subscribers for a streaming service, the networks become less valuable, which is sure to be part of YouTube TV’s counterargument.
    Add in the wrinkle that NBCU was trying to boost Peacock’s user numbers by including paid carriage of the service, and you can see why YouTube TV balked, lest it be subjected to every other media-owned SVOD being carried in future negotiations. It also is an admission on NBCU’s part that the full NBCU experience is no longer available via TV alone, but viewers should still pay more for the diminishing returns available to them.
    It’s hard to see an easy compromise being reached. YouTube TV has already gone on record to say it will lower the monthly subscription by $10 should NBCU’s networks be blacked out, suggesting it expects this outcome. Neither will want to back down: NBCU for the precedent being set to other pay TV providers and YouTube for fear of driving up subscriber losses.
    It is due time for media companies to realize they can’t have their cake and eat it too in a world with shrinking customers yet increased revenues. YouTube TV is just the beginning, with this pattern set to continue with every round of negotiations. The sooner TV networks come to terms with the reality they’ve been staring at for years, the better it will be for consumers. The question is, how long will they be able to drag out this charade.

  7. Ra

    September 29, 2021 at 6:54 pm

    @Michael F. I have the same issue with my Tab S7+. I think that the app erroneously recognizes them as mobile devices.

  8. Michael F

    September 29, 2021 at 6:49 pm

    @Ra. It’s ok on the Samsung 4K Smart TV, and seems to translate best on the Apple TV 4th gen, while not doing as well on iPad Pro 2nd gen. Odd.

  9. Ra

    September 29, 2021 at 6:33 pm

    @Michael F. My chromecast was showing a very crisp picture today. It will start with a lower resolution but crisp out in about 15 sec like Netflix.

  10. Michael F

    September 29, 2021 at 6:21 pm

    @Ra. I did sign up and am watching a replay from yesterday’s matches. I do really wish the video quality was better on Paramount+ for matches. Its lacking that crispness you see from ESPN+ and Peacock (yes Peacock). And funny thing, Paramount+ lists their video as 1080p like Peacock, but there is definitely a difference.

  11. Ra

    September 29, 2021 at 4:04 pm

    @Michael F. In reference to “Although I will check in on other euro league matches from time to time, and of course follow the Champions League (especially when it reaches knock out rounds). I actually am now compelled to sign up with Paramount+ to catch champions league this early on, since some good matchups have already aired.”

    You are missing some of the best action on the Globe. You don’t need to miss it out. It’s only $5. Use half of the $10 you’ll get from YTV tomorrow and enjoy it!!… 🙂

  12. Michael F

    September 29, 2021 at 3:17 pm

    @JP. True. But as an American, it might be surprising to say that I am not one to enjoy all the in between week analysis from American sports as much. Especially the NFL, where they raise their voice at you and shout their opinions like kids in a school yard.

    I do enjoy the English pundits and hosts a lot, as they provide their respectful viewpoint in a much more calm, civil manner. It’s much more a respectful discussion with a spice of good humor, and not people talking or yelling over one another to make their points.

  13. JP

    September 29, 2021 at 2:58 pm

    @MichaelF, fair enough. All of us who care enough to listen each week and comment are odd ducks in the landscape of American sports fans anyway 🙂

  14. Michael F

    September 29, 2021 at 2:46 pm

    @JP. Forgive me, but I am not intending to insinuate that fans that have different viewing habits or how they follow this beautiful game as being shallow.

    I happen to like analysis and viewpoints and interviews from managers and players and reactions before and after the games and all the hype. But that’s just me.

  15. JP

    September 29, 2021 at 2:40 pm

    @MichaelF, you always bring up this in depth coverage ALL the clubs in the EPL receives from NBC, and how other leagues get “shallow” coverage. It is insinuated fans who follow multiple leagues and just want to watch the games are somehow lesser than fans who want that “depth”

    I consider myself one of these fans, with Serie A on top of the pecking order. The reason European soccer is a breath of fresh air to follow (here at least) is we don’t get the “storylines” from the media covering it. The matches themselves are the story line, don’t need depth (or hype) on a 24/7 channel to know what’s going on. Some talking head on TV discussing Salernitana would not add to my enjoyment. Know what’s going on from watching the matches and following how the results are impacting the table. As the season progresses the “storylines” become evident with which clubs are contending, which are in danger of relegation, which are fighting for European spots, and as a result, which upcoming matches hold importance. Nothing is needed to do all this besides a way to watch ALL the matches, and a simple app dedicated to soccer.

    The “storylines” I associate with media coverage is usually gossip and manufactured drama. Not saying that’s what NBC provides, just what I think when storylines and sports are part of the same conversation.

    Also, ESPN+ and Paramount+ do include the weekly magazine shows (previewing the next round along with some “in depth” coverage of a player/coach, etc) and highlight shows of the previous round (for all matches). How much more is really needed??

  16. Michael F

    September 29, 2021 at 1:59 pm

    All good commentary, and perhaps I have incited these posts that the EPL should be exclusive. That’s probably taking that thought too far, but I am concerned over which carrier gets it next for the treatment it will receive.

    I love following a league in depth, all the clubs and their storylines. I might be in the minority here. I don’t just watch any euro league match just because it is considered high profile and the top teams playing. Although I will check in on other euro league matches from time to time, and of course follow the Champions League (especially when it reaches knock out rounds). I actually am now compelled to sign up with Paramount+ to catch champions league this early on, since some good matchups have already aired.

    Anyway, here is my concern. Whoever gets the EPL, I want the following that I currently get with NBC/Peacock: In-depth coverage and analysis of ALL the clubs on match day and throughout the week, not just all the matches aired.

    I also hope to get all the shoulder programming directly from the 24/7 Premier League TV channel currently on Peacock, along with some of those programs being available on demand. I would really, really miss that, if we no longer got this programming. Perhaps whoever picks up EPL, will be given this 24/7 PL channel and it’s on-demand programming, because it is a delight to follow throughout the week, not just on match day. That would do it for me.

  17. Hans

    September 29, 2021 at 12:16 pm

    Just my take here and it could be totally off. The TV rights are issued to different regions in the world and the EPL has different goals for those different regions depending on the audience.
    In the UK you have a very knowledgeable audience and it may be considered like a home crowd therefor they know where to go on their networks the EPL really doesn’t have to grow the brand they just have to make sure they don’t loose viewers and get the largest fee.
    However in other regions like the US the EPL is not the main sporting event it is a niche product and needs to grow their brand. How to do that best is really up to them as they have experience in that in other regions, We often associate the growing of a brand with the front and center presence on the broadcast media, the promoting of events to reach an audience that is not aware of the sport.
    In addition the EPL represents clubs and these clubs have different sizes of global audiences and they want to sell their merchandise globally. Some clubs sign players just for the purpose of selling to an audience where this player is popular like Real Madrid signing Beckham for the Asian audience.
    So, often we like to see for ease of use the EPL on a network that gives it an air of exclusivity and it will help us to find individuals that are like minded and we can engage in communication with them. For me it doesn’t matter where the EPL is as long as I have a choice to select games to my liking. Now my preference would be EPL’s own DTC with a studio panel and commentators collected from the best in the world, as long as they stay away from the way sports events have been commercialized like the US has done with its most popular sports.

  18. Mercator

    September 29, 2021 at 10:13 am

    It’s a non-sense assumption and the EPL shares broadcasters with other leagues in plenty of markets. It’s inevitable in most markets, there are one or two potential buyers who show everything. I don’t know why people have this bizarre idea the EPL wants to be the ONLY football league on whatever broadcaster they go with. Seems to be an arbitrary criteria with the only possible purpose of making NBC look good.

    And everyone else here is right, the CBS presentation yesterday was better than anything I’ve seen NBC do. They had Thierry Henry on! With all due respect Robbie Earl isn’t going to tell me anything about a player like Theirry was able to speak about Mbappe. Nothing against Arlo White and the like but Schmichel just straight up asked Pep why didn’t you play a striker – incredibly awkward but thats the question we all want to know and he just bluntly said it, Pep gave a nonsense answer like how couldn’t we all understand Sterling was the striker. Good journalism, great studio set. Again, nothing against NBC but this idea there is no other broadcaster that can do the EPL justice is ridiculous. CBS is putting out great presentations for Champions League and even for CONCACAF games, and the best part is it’s all on the app for $5. No screwing around with cable or your provider dropping the channel.

  19. disco george

    September 29, 2021 at 9:57 am

    Legit question, not trying to be snarky or contrarian…
    We hear a lot about the Premier League not wanting to share coverage with other leagues. Is this a strategy only for broadcasters outside of the UK? I’m curious because Sky airs Bundesliga matches (and a bunch of other non-Big 5 leagues), but Sky also has a zillionty channels so the Premier League is never going to be crowded out on TV, either.

  20. Ra

    September 29, 2021 at 8:27 am

    I like Rebecca Lowe. But I would have a single Thierry or Klinsmann over the whole roster of analysts at NBC (Robbie Earle, Robbie Mustoe, Tim Howard, Danny Higginbotham). They sound knowledgeable because they are pretentious. I am not impressed.
    I prefer fun and funny over this kind of commentary at any time. I tuned in last week to ESPN FC after PSG’s match just to hear Moreno comment on Neymar’s fabricated penalty. That is the only thing I was looking for in that specific program. And I had a good laugh indeed when he said that that was absolutely no penalty, but he was impressed by the technique and it should be taught in his ‘diving school’.

  21. Ra

    September 29, 2021 at 7:47 am

    Besides Thierry, I really enjoy Kate. She seems natural. Her best moment yesterday was when she said she thought that Guardiola talks to people as if they were half idiot.

  22. Michael F

    September 29, 2021 at 12:24 am

    @Hans. I am sure it was good. Its interesting that Thierry Henry was also special guest on latest Sky Sports podcast, which is owned by you know who. Smile These good pundits are found everywhere where soccer is taken seriously.

  23. Hans

    September 28, 2021 at 11:44 pm

    The whole studio show over on paramount was absolutely fantastic. What Henry brought to the expert analysis was top class punditry can’t imagine that NBC has the same creative minds and I guess that is what Ra is referring to when he says “to hear commentary from knowledgeable people that won World Cups”. I thoroughly enjoyed the lighter side of the show also and CBS is doing its part in that by creating an Avengers promo for this day, with Henry as Captain America, Richards as the Hulk, Schmeichel as Iron Man, imgur com/JEBFBSC
    I do believe that ViacomCBS is taking their football property really serious.

  24. Michael F

    September 28, 2021 at 10:30 pm

    @Ra. Swoosh. That was a shot fired my way, I believe. These used to be targeted only at Comcast, but you aimed it in a different direction this time. I felt the breeze. Haha

  25. Ra

    September 28, 2021 at 10:15 pm

    @Michael F. Or maybe it is because I am spoiled. I am used to hear commentary from knowleadgble people that won World Cups…

  26. Michael F

    September 28, 2021 at 10:10 pm

    @Ra. You are right. I stand corrected. You are entitled to your opinion. It is a matter of taste. I am sure I would like CBS coverage. I do enjoy humor like the podcasts from BBC Football Daily. Those guys know how to have fun, while being very interesting to listen to.

  27. Ra

    September 28, 2021 at 10:06 pm

    @Michael F. Last time I checked I was entitled to have my own opinion. CBS studio today was great and funny! I stand my ground. Watch it in the highlights and then you let me know. NBC’s studio coverage seems too pretentious at times. But if you are used to English soccer you might be used to it.

  28. Michael F

    September 28, 2021 at 10:01 pm

    @Ra. Let’s just keep separate what NBC studio analysts and hosts etc do well, from the rest of the garbage about Comcast that you can’t seem to want to give a rest for a moment to any of the readers here, shall we? We know what the issues are, everyone does. You don’t have to continue re-educating us over and over and over. It’s like every post you give, at every opportunity. It’s gotten very personal for you with regards Comcast, and for that I kind of feel sorry for you… as there are plenty of injustices in the world far, far worse than this.

  29. Michael F

    September 28, 2021 at 9:55 pm

    @Ra. I am sure CBS does well. But to say they are better from your standpoint when you haven’t and don’t watch NBC regularly because you don’t have their channels due to understandably not wanting to give money to the cable conglomerate you despise, tells me you opinion is incredibly subjective and one sided and is plainly a matter of taste.

  30. Ra

    September 28, 2021 at 9:19 pm

    @Michael F. Yes, among others… 🙂
    Today’s coverage of CBS was better than NBC’s. Thierry did an amazing job and it was brilliant from Peter to get a tactical explanation from Guardiola. Very awkward and entertaining. Did you watch it? If you didn’t, check in the highlights…

  31. Hans

    September 28, 2021 at 8:11 pm

    Precious comedy strip and fits like hand in glove.

  32. Michael F

    September 28, 2021 at 8:00 pm

    @Ra Where have you seen this better coverage, from Star Plus? Haha. That’s a joke. Just kidding around.

  33. Ra

    September 28, 2021 at 5:52 pm

    @locofooty. And “its media-division results include a loss of $363M related to Peacock”
    They can’t grow the service and are losing money. That’s sheer incompetence and it actually reflects Comcast’s challenge of attracting customers with a customer-centric offer.
    Every time I think of them, I remember the Dilbert comic strips. This one captures their thinking in a nutshell:
    dilbert com/strip/2012-02-19

  34. locofooty

    September 28, 2021 at 5:39 pm

    That article posted by WST on Twitter about the dispute is really damning on Comcast. Yikes.

  35. Hans

    September 28, 2021 at 4:22 pm

    locofooty. Much of that has moved also to Reddit and onto Discord servers where you find these communities now. The trackers I am on now I have been on for years and you have a measure of credibility and trust. It just seems you get a better service there then from the networks and there support personnel.
    Paramount+ stopped streaming to a Windows 7 box with Chrome browser. Paramount+ support couldn’t fix it. Reddit did, just install an Extension that announces the browser as Chrome on Windows 10, job done.

  36. locofooty

    September 28, 2021 at 3:52 pm

    Hans, I remember the old Maxxed Football Forums. Current matches, classic matches, highlights shows, documentaries, specials. It was heaven in an era when matches weren’t available that easy. It was a great community. Remember to always seed and not be just a leech. Good times.

  37. Hans

    September 28, 2021 at 3:18 pm

    The ones that hate cable distribution are actually in an excellent position. What is happening on the broadcast side is very quickly shifting. Piracy is of main concern to the EPL but the pirates are also shifting their operation and are keeping ahead of the mess that many of the distributors of sporting events have made, Here are some of my reasonings.
    1. Qatar owns BeIN and Saudi Arabia pirates some of the EPL games.
    2. IPTV providers for a few dollars a month openly advertises channels that show EPL games.
    3. For the 1st time have I seen donations on private, invitation ONLY trackers pay for live TV broadcast on their sites as well as pay for a DTC subscriptions used by their top cappers and uploaders. These guys have circumvented any DRM restrictions and the knowledge is not public. Games are available in less then an hour after completion in the best possible quality. These communities are dedicated to providing the best sporting events in the best quality with the least amount of hassle and they give the feeling of a family environment. I have seen people volunteer money and subscriptions so that a close nit group enjoys their sports. It is very difficult to leave that environment when you look at the alternative of the clusterf**k that the networks offer. I do make an exception here for Paramount+ and ESPN+
    Bottom line, it may be compared to the prohibition time, people will go through great lengths and risks for what they want and demand. There are groups of people out there that will fill those wants and needs and the EPL as well as other providers know this.
    I rather not bother with jumping through hoops to get what I want but as already mentioned when it reaches a certain level of being pissed off and aggravated, I will go the route of getting my content even if it means extra steps of setup. So EPL get this viewing rights in the US sorted either you get our money or the pirates get it your choice.

  38. Ra

    September 28, 2021 at 3:08 pm

    @Michael F. I wouldn’t go as far as to call it a gold standard. I’ve seen much better coverages over the years.
    With investment, any other player can do a better job. The bar is not that high.

  39. Michael F

    September 28, 2021 at 2:43 pm

    @Ra. I don’t know to your question. I didnt see that myself if it is true… and i watch a LOT of EPL matches on delay via DVR or on demand later on Peacock. I would be surprised and certainly not happy if they broke completely away from a match in progress (ie not at half time). I wonder if this was really just some advertisement on the screen by scorebug (as you referenced earlier) as match continued? Still somewhat intrusive, but definitely not the same thing.

  40. locofooty

    September 28, 2021 at 2:43 pm

    Michael F, Agree. Good coverage is not exclusive to only linear networks though. I think a league can be covered well in an all streaming platform. Seems like P+ does pretty well with UCL with pre and post match, studio shows, analysts and everything else. It can happen. On the other side, there is a good point made that things could get too crowded at a streaming service that has too many products. Just like if NBC had more sports properties, I don’t think EPL would’ve gotten the same type of coverage. Things fit nicely and accommodated very well for the EPL/NBCSN partnership and in my opinion it has peaked.

  41. Ra

    September 28, 2021 at 2:31 pm

    We will find out soon enough who they will pick and then we get to decide if we want to subscribe or not.
    In the meantime, is it true that they aired commercials in the middle of the game?

  42. Michael F

    September 28, 2021 at 2:19 pm

    @locofooty You could be right. Good take. However, they will want to land with a provider that can take it even further because that makes business sense. It’s not just about the initial pay off contract as that would not be a well rounded strategy moving forward.

  43. Michael F

    September 28, 2021 at 2:17 pm

    @Ra in addition… i do take notice of your balance compliment regarding NBC’s match coverage of the EPL. Good note. its true. it is still is the gold standard for the rest.

  44. Michael F

    September 28, 2021 at 2:15 pm

    @Ra with all due respect, i didn’t bring up the topic specific to Comcast at all… you did. You keep taking an opportunity to lodge repeated complaints about Comcast practically every time I make a post not at all related to Comcast or its present coverage of the EPL.

  45. Tom

    September 28, 2021 at 2:05 pm

    There’s nothing more uplifting than when a multi-billion dollar company (Google) argues over money with another multi-billion dollar company (Comcast) and regular people get to bear the aggravation of it.

  46. locofooty

    September 28, 2021 at 2:00 pm

    Michael F, I think the business model has peaked as it’s been commented in other threads. NBC has done a great job with coverage despite all the Comcast shortcomings. Ratings have pretty much plateaued. EPL is looking to get paid now.

  47. Ra

    September 28, 2021 at 1:54 pm

    @Michael F I don’t want to discuss this again either. I was actually complimenting NBC’s coverage and added it so as not to finish my comment appearing to support NBC when I obviously don’t. It is a pity that great professionals get their work compromised by Comcast’s lack of customer focus and strategy.

    By the way, people mentioned that the USA network showed commercials during the game. Is it true? (It would be insane, but I wouldn’t be surprised.)

  48. Michael F

    September 28, 2021 at 1:37 pm

    Correction on above sentence — should be: ‘I was talking about the EXPLORATION of EPL’s plans for next contract, whether Comcast or ESPN or other is a serious bidder or not.”

  49. Michael F

    September 28, 2021 at 1:35 pm

    @Ra. I am fully aware of all the complaints about Comcast. Unless you are just repeating this once again for new readers on this site. I gotta believe you are just repeating the same thing over for those are already well aware of the dissatisfaction regarding Comcast.

    How about we move past these same complaints and repeating them and talk about something of a topic I raised above that had really nothing to do with Comcast?

    I was talking about the expiration of EPL’s plans for next contract, whether Comcast or ESPN or other is a serious bidder or not.

    I honestly feel that sometimes people don’t think out of the box and only are concerned to get a product on something they are currently subscribed to because it suits themelves only. I raised something that concerns a business model and what makes sense for the English Premier League. I guess no one wanted to play, and instead want to regurgitate more of the same complaints about Comcast. Smile.

  50. Ra

    September 28, 2021 at 12:59 pm

    @Michael F. NBC does a good coverage with EPL with the exception of their horrendous, obtrusive and ad invested scorebug. But is the worst place to watch and as a company, Comcast is deplorable. That is why people here rant about them all the time.

  51. Michael F

    September 28, 2021 at 12:47 pm

    @Ra. I know what source you obtained that quote from. I see we look at the same sources on the internet. That’s one of my favorite go to sources for streaming info.

  52. locofooty

    September 28, 2021 at 12:42 pm

    The main problem for NBC/Telemundo Sports is that Comcast is behind. A cable company with predatory practices, horrible customer service, a mediocre streaming service, and they will look to keep the TV rights hostage so that people keep subscribing to obsolete cable packages.

  53. Ra

    September 28, 2021 at 12:34 pm

    I got this from a different source:

    Now, Lightshed reports that Peacock could be the reason for the dispute.

    “NBCU is trying to force YouTube TV to bundle and pay for Peacock Premium as part of a new affiliation agreement for the NBCU channels,” Lightshed’s Rich Greenfield reports. “With NBCU struggling with marketing Peacock direct-to-consumer (evidenced by their talking about ‘registrations’ vs. ‘paying subscribers’), they are falling back on their legacy business model of wholesale bundling to drive distribution.”

    While Google doesn’t regularly report subscriber numbers for YouTube TV, Greenfield believes that the current number could be around 4 million subscribers, putting YouTube TV above Hulu with Live TV. It’s likely that NBCU isn’t just looking for more money from the carriage deal, but also improved subscriber numbers for its own streaming service.

  54. Michael F

    September 28, 2021 at 12:26 pm

    @Ra. I would like to believe I am reasonable. Smile. I think you mistaken my previous posts as EPL’s only option is to continue with a cable like conglomerate such as Comcast’s NBC. I would like to go on record to say I am not.

    I believe EPL has all kinds of exploratory options for coverage in the States. I have brought these up before on the heels of @Hans first bringing them up. Amazon Prime, Apple+, Netflix, HBO/Max. Some provider, where soccer is not already a major player and consuming other euro leagues.

    I think that would be in the best interests of the EPL and the other Euro leagues that already have a contract with a provider.

    @JP. Of course money talks. But a good present and future strategy is also very important for growth and promotion of the sport. That turns into money gained or lost along the way.

  55. Ra

    September 28, 2021 at 12:13 pm

    @Michael F. You seem to be someone very reasonable and I would like to hear from you. I am asking in good faith.
    Would you mind paying another $5 (which would give you a total of $15; total subscription $70) to keep NBCUniversal channels or would you try and find another provider? What if NBC is also able to increase prices for Hulu live, FuboTV and Sling?
    I am asking because at some point people will decide that enough is enough (also known as elasticity curve). Youtube started at $35 in 2017 with not so many fewer channels. At what price would you cancel it? For me, I would get either service for no more than $20 (YoutubeTV, Hulu Live, FuboTV) and SlingBlue for no more than $10 (without having to churn accounts).

  56. Ra

    September 28, 2021 at 11:46 am

    Not being satisfied with the status quo, I am really enjoying seeing YouTube TV and NBC fight. But I already know who will lose in the end – it will be the customer, as it is always the case.

  57. Carol

    September 28, 2021 at 11:43 am

    I watch NBC all the time and would look elsewhere if you tube can’t fix their problem

  58. Mercator

    September 28, 2021 at 11:22 am

    Another disgraceful move by NBC, absolute clowns and I really really hope they lose the rights. Think hard EPL, we already all hate peacock, and NBC is about to pull the plug on millions of viewers with Youtube TV. It will be a disaster to stay with NBC, it has BEIN written all over it again. They will do the same nonsense with Fubo, Hulu and the like in due course, and people will get sick of hopping around for one channel and will find other ways to spend their weekend mornings.

    I pirate 100% of NBC’s content and I will do so until they lose the rights, so this isn’t much bother for me. That said, Youtube TV is cutting prices by $10, and Sling is only $10 a month and comes with the NBC channels for those of you really determined to give this criminal enterprise your hard earned money.

  59. JP

    September 28, 2021 at 11:11 am

    @MichaelF. Money talks. EPL will go where the cash is. Prior to NBC they shared Fox with UCL/EL and Serie A (and others), so if they choose CBS it will be back to the future haha. Don’t want that to happen though. Hoping somehow it stays with Peacock or goes to Amazon or Apple. If it goes to ESPN or CBS it would be all EPL talk, which would be fine if I cared about EPL, but mostly don’t.

  60. Michael F

    September 28, 2021 at 10:58 am

    @JP. I understand how you and other soccer fans would love that scenario, but I think you missed the point of my post.

    I don’t believe a league like EPL wants to take a back seat or share coverage with anyone. They want exclusive treatment as they are a proud franchise and know and realize how popular they are world wide and in the states.

    That said, for those like me that follow a specific league in depth, the viewer will no doubt be disappointed if EPL shifted to ESPN, if they treat the EPL like they have the other Euro leagues they currently have. And I believe that EPL is fully aware of the kind of viewership they have in the States. The fans of the EPL have been treated to exclusive coverage of its league and in depth coverage of all its clubs (not just top 6), and they will want that to continue.

  61. JP

    September 28, 2021 at 10:49 am

    @MichaelF, as one who just wants to watch the matches and views pre/post and other programming as nice extras, but not vital, all the Euro leagues on one service would be amazing.
    All the Bundesliga matches are still available, the complaints were about less Bundesliga 2 matches (because ESPN won’t air without commentary).
    After spending 1.4 billion on La Liga, would also be surprised if they overspend for EPL too. At some point it’s just too much to justify, even if the plan is for loss leaders to gain subscribers. How many hardcore EPL fans (that would follow them to any new provider) at the moment don’t already have ESPN+??
    Kartik always mentions how many EPL fans don’t view any other leagues, so maybe there’s a lot. But my guess is these fans must dabble in ESPN+ already and the gains could not justify the reported 2 billion over 6 years.

  62. Michael F

    September 28, 2021 at 10:38 am

    I am interested in Ernie’s secret informer that ESPN is a lock to get the EPL next season.

    On a sort of related topic, I am kind of scratching my head that ESPN went all out to over pay for LaLiga. I realize some of it was a product of bad timing with an exodus of key superstar names from this league they couldn’t foresee happening (i.e. Messi being at the forefront), but we all knew the league was hurting financially.

    The reason I bring this up I am surprised that ESPN just didn’t wait it out one more season to go all out to obtain the rights for the EPL in 2022. I mean, some soccer fans will think it’s great to have all euro leagues on one streaming provider, but is that good for all the euro leagues on that same provider? As it is, people have already complained and has been pointed out here on WST podcasts that Bundesliga has taken a back seat on ESPN+ as not all the Bundesliga matches are available on ESPN+. LaLiga now is getting the more prioritized attention and coverage on ESPN+.

    So what happens if ESPN+ gets the EPL next season? What happens to LaLiga and Bundesliga?? Both those less popular euro leagues take a further back seat in coverage from ESPN+. There is only so many resources from one provider to handle the coverage of multiple leagues.

    I contend it’s not good at all for any of these euro leagues to be slammed packed into one provider.

  63. Ra

    September 28, 2021 at 9:37 am

    I did some more research and apparently, no ATSC 3.0 broadcasters in my area are transmitting in 4k other than demo loops. You can check available channels here:
    en.wikipedia org/wiki/ATSC_3.0
    However, they are transmitting in 1080p rather than the ATSC1.0 standard of 1080i (which is 30fps) or 720p (60fps).

  64. JP

    September 28, 2021 at 9:25 am

    @Ra, while Bundesliga is entertaining, it’s the league that falls mostly out of my viewing habits. Will always check it out beginning of the year when all the leagues have more spaced out games (later for Spain because of the heat, etc). But once they settle in, Bundesliga often up against Serie A (9am vs 9:30 and 12pm vs 11:30/12:30) and I rarely choose it. Think it’s also a reason why my viewing of Eredivisie and Belgian Pro League are maintained throughout the year, often have start times that don’t compete or the overlap is such that can still see most of it. Timing is everything when we have 6-7 leagues to choose from!

    Will say, my viewing of La Liga has plummeted this year so far. Instead of just turning on beIN and getting sucked into a midtable clash, more selective of the matches I choose. Has mostly been Real Madrid if up against a foe I also like (Villarreal, Valencia, Betis types), or Atleti matches. Barca has been boring whenever I watched so far, maybe the return if Fati will change that though. Also, far too many La Liga matches I’ve watched have had Alejandro Moreno commentating and that kills the experience.

  65. Ra

    September 28, 2021 at 7:49 am

    That is a key reason why I have a strong distaste for LaLiga. Madrid is a corrupt colonialist capital. If it wasn’t for Bundesliga, I would have canceled my ESPN+ the moment they got those rights:

    “New legal battle
    In its ongoing legal battle with the Super League rebel clubs, UEFA said in a statement on Tuesday that it “does not recognise the jurisdiction of the Court in Madrid” and will be making an appeal to a higher court in Madrid.

    UEFA added it had made formal submissions to the Court in Madrid “evidencing its ongoing compliance with the orders.”

    “In addition, UEFA has filed a motion for the recusal of the judge presiding over the current proceedings as it believes there are significant irregularities in these proceedings,” UEFA said.

    “In line with Spanish law — and in the fundamental interests of justice — UEFA fully expects the judge in question to immediately stand aside pending the full and proper consideration of this motion.

    “UEFA will continue to take all necessary steps, in strict accordance with national and EU law, in order to defend its interests and — most importantly — those of its members and all football stakeholders.”

  66. UnitedFan 3478

    September 28, 2021 at 7:15 am

    @Ernie Where did you hear that?

  67. Ernie

    September 27, 2021 at 11:14 pm

    No worries (I hear) all EPL games will be with ESPN next year

  68. Hans

    September 27, 2021 at 9:48 pm

    My weekly highlights are download the posted Match Of The Day and MOTD2. Job done with excellent panel personnel.

  69. Ra

    September 27, 2021 at 9:30 pm

    I can’t even watch the highlights with these freaking ads. It really bothers me to the point that it draws my attention from the game. If Pecock decides to simulcast, I will need post its to cover it.

  70. locofooty

    September 27, 2021 at 9:26 pm

    Speaking of ads, someone mentioned there were commercials during one of the matches that aired on USA. I never saw more comments about it. True? How intrusive was it on the screen?

  71. Ra

    September 27, 2021 at 9:20 pm

    Watching highlights on YouTube…those scorebugs from NBCSN are the worst ever. So obtrusive and they have freaking ads at all times. The one from the world feed is great. It is amazing how NBC is able to crapify any property.

  72. Hans

    September 27, 2021 at 8:49 pm

    Just another thought on the NBCSN EPL matches since that channel gets shut down as of December 31st I am not sure if there is an exclusive agreement between Comscum and the vMVDPs such as Sling and FuvoTV to continue these matches on a cable channel they carry. This is all up in the air and if you subscribe to a vMVDP into 2022 you may not be able to get those EPL games using them since NBCSN is dead in 2022.

  73. Ra

    September 27, 2021 at 8:45 pm

    @SF You can get another match from Telemundo. Put the video on and sync with the audio from Talksport.

  74. SF

    September 27, 2021 at 8:32 pm

    Thanks for the feedback. I do the same (ESPN+, Peacock, Paramount+) for the same type of access. The gap will be those PL matches live on the NBC cable channels. Full disclose – I am a Chelsea supporter. So I think if I don’t want to cough up the YTTV/HULU/FUBO type sub fees, its an OTA antennae for the NBC Sunday match and/or wait the damn 24 hours for Peacock replays. 🙂
    Thanks gents.

  75. Ra

    September 27, 2021 at 8:26 pm

    Is this an advertisement piece for FuboTV? Sling is the cheapest option and it wasn’t even mentioned: $10 first month, $35 after using Sling blue.
    It should be disclosed if it is.

  76. Ra

    September 27, 2021 at 8:21 pm

    @SF Same here. With ESPN+ (all Bundesliga, Eridivisie, LaLiga, Belgian) and Paramount+ (Champions, Italian, Brazilian, Argentinean) you can watch pretty much all soccer out there with the exception of EPL.

  77. Hans

    September 27, 2021 at 8:11 pm

    You may not have followed the banter here about this issue, most of us that don’t have cable have used a combination of streaming service. I have Peacock for EPL, Rugby $50 per year. ESPN+ for Bundesliga, Cup matches and ESPN-FC show $50 per year (now $60) plus Paramount+ for Serie A plus all the European competitions and here I splurged $100 per year advertisement free. That means watching a show on replay it is now 42-44 minutes long instead of 60 minutes plus I get my local CBS station free streamed over the internet. So that averages out to about $18 per month.

  78. SF

    September 27, 2021 at 7:43 pm

    Thanks Chris and Hans. I watch so little cable TV that $65/month is ridiculous. Just to watch PL matches on the NBC cable channels or the rare ESPN match of La Liga/Bundesliga – hard to justify.

  79. Hans

    September 27, 2021 at 7:31 pm

    Has nothing to do with any technical issues it is a Comscum issue they don’t want to, as the history bears out, changing from a few hours last season to now over 24 hours. Never need to watch a delayed replay of the EPL as the full matches are posted on-line less then an hour after completion. Mind you I subscribe to Peacock for watching a different sport, Rugby and the replays are available very shortly after match completion.

  80. Hans

    September 27, 2021 at 7:26 pm

    For me the switch to 4K is very easy, my digital antenna works so just replace my present HDHomerun box with 2 tuners with the HDHomerun 4k box with 4 tuners or the same box with a preloaded DVR thus not needing a NAS.
    Some of the specs:
    • 4 tuners
    • ATSC 3.0 (on 2 tuners)
    • ATSC 1.0 (on 4 tuners)
    • ClearQAM US-cable (on 4 tuners)
    In the greater Washington DC area just a very few stations had ATSC 3.0 going into the summer. So for me it is still a few years away.

  81. SF

    September 27, 2021 at 7:19 pm

    Why does it take 24 hours for Peacock to stream match replays that aired on NBCsn, USA, or NBC?

    • Christopher Harris

      September 27, 2021 at 7:26 pm

      Why? NBC Sports wants to offer an incentive for cable and satellite customers to keep their TV service and so they don’t cut the cord. They don’t want everyone to move to streaming.

  82. Ra

    September 27, 2021 at 5:54 pm

    @Hans @Michael F Have any of you looked into 4k OTA. I am curious about it but have not heard many comments in terms of satisfaction and actual program availability. It should use the same antenna (but needs a different tuner).

    “Here’s the top-line info:
    If you get your TV from streaming, cable or satellite, NextGen TV/ATSC 3.0 won’t affect you at all.
    The transition is voluntary. Stations don’t have to switch. Many have already, however, for reasons we’ll explain below.
    It’s not backwards-compatible with the current HD (ATSC 1.0) standard, so your current TV won’t be able to receive it. Your current antenna should work fine though.
    Stations that switch to NextGen TV will still have to keep broadcasting ATSC 1.0 for five years.
    There are multiple models and sizes of TV with built-in tuners available now from Sony, Samsung and LG.
    By the end of 2021, roughly 70% of the US population will have access to NextGen broadcasts, including big cities such as New York and Los Angeles. Many small- and midsized cities already have stations broadcasting. “

  83. Ra

    September 27, 2021 at 5:50 pm

    @Hans. I paid Dish $150 to install a roof-mounted OTA antenna for me. It is made in Spain and came with a nice 2-way amplified splitter. I connected it to a Tablo (the old version) and a fireTV recast. I bought the recast because I was not willing to pay tablo $5/mo just for the guide. But I got upset with all the ads on the fire stick. So I keep switching from chromecast (live and apps) to firestick (recordings). My setup is not as fancy as yours but here is the interesting part – I can access my FireTV recast live stream and recordings from anywhere in the world using the mobile apps (or at least this was the case before Covid hit and I decided to stay put for a while). I considered taking an antenna and recast on my next trip and leave the equipment behind, but neither is compatible yet.
    @Michael F. Interesting that only they would carry it. It still has some very nice programming.

  84. Michael F

    September 27, 2021 at 5:45 pm

    Btw… on most days, OTA is great for me… no issues. And i like to use from time to time because there is absolutely no compression. On a big screen 4k ready tv, you definitely notice the difference.

  85. Michael F

    September 27, 2021 at 5:38 pm

    @Ra. Yes i have amplified signal box for the OTA antenna.

    Btw… U tube TV is the only live tv stream service that carries PBS to date. That is a huge win for many that like their unique programming. Surprised that other live tv stream services have yet to step up and carry PBS. Its a staple for decades in many households – long before cable tv! Who didnt get exposed to Monty Python’s Flying Circus via PBS in the ‘70s.

  86. Hans

    September 27, 2021 at 5:38 pm

    I have a powerful antenna in my attic pointing towards the transmission towers and I live about 30 miles away from the center of Washington DC. I have a SiliconDust HDHoimerun tuner connected to the antenna and get over 60 channels. Never ever had a problem with reception. The HDHomerun tuner is connected via my network to an EMBY server that runs on a QNAP NAS which gives me an EPG so it looks just like what you get on cable plus I can record on the QNAP NAS. This was an inexpensive one time investment several years ago and is not even difficult for a newbie to setup and as a bonus TV channels are on my WiFi and available on all connected devices.

  87. Ra

    September 27, 2021 at 5:25 pm

    PS: PBS also transmits their live feed through their app.

  88. Ra

    September 27, 2021 at 5:23 pm

    @Michael F. Do you have a good signal amplifier? An amplified signal is much more resilient to pixelation. My location is also tricky, and a roof-mounted antenna (installed by Dish) and an amplifier do the trick for me.
    Also, you can get CBS live with Paramount (and Sunday Night Football with Peacock) to resort to in inclement weather conditions.

  89. Michael F

    September 27, 2021 at 5:15 pm

    @JP Right on with your comment. OTA can be tricky depending on where you live. Its why most probably don’t even bother with OTA as something to rely on.

    In the valley or around a lot of trees and reception can be spotty. On windy days it cause pixelating. I have a strong OTA roof antenna that gets stations 150 miles away. It also can be a problem for OTA local stations in in climate weather or when its windy. Its just not that reliable and when you plan to watch live sports and have friends over, that is a plan you don’t want to rely on.

  90. JP

    September 27, 2021 at 5:03 pm

    @Ra, yes OTA, but doubt most subscribers to YTTV also have an antenna. The peacock option does work for them and kind of undercuts any leverage NBC has here. We know soccer is a niche here, so the ones losing access to EPL on NBCSN won’t hurt them as much in terms of public relations

  91. Ra

    September 27, 2021 at 4:55 pm

    @JP Sunday Night Football is on OTA NBC. Only hermits don’t have access to it. Comcast is sounding like a beggar asking for money in this one. They should write something more customer-oriented and straight to the point as Google:
    “If NBCU offers us equitable terms, we’ll renew our agreement with them. However, if we are unable to reach a deal by Thursday, the NBCU lineup of channels will no longer be available on YouTube TV and we will decrease our monthly price by $10, from $64.99 to $54.99 (while this content remains off our platform). You can sign up for NBC’s own direct-to-consumer streaming service, Peacock, which they offer for $4.99/month to continue watching NBCU content, such as Sunday Night Football.”

  92. JP

    September 27, 2021 at 4:30 pm

    Also, the original beIN dispute started in the week(s) leading up to the start of La Liga that year.

  93. JP

    September 27, 2021 at 4:27 pm

    It seems these disputes always come at opportune times (depending how you look at it). I recall losing Fox to a dispute in the week leading up to Thanksgiving (and Thanksgiving day NFL). Makes subscribers, in theory, put maximum pressure on their carrier to resolve ASAP.

    You mentioned the possibility of no Sunday Night Football, but should note it’s not an ordinary game. It’s the most hyped game in recent memory with Tom Brady returning to face Belichick and the Patriots.

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